The Ironic Miracle

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

© Mr. Robin Parsons :cool: Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

4:30 PM 24/06/2006

In Another forum (I) had explained to someone, one of the reasons "why" We are not supposed to be 'testing' God....

Goes like this...

Human Looks up, asks God to perform a Miracle, Claiming that: if God Does, then they will Believe in 'him' Fooooor-ever, So God Performs a Miracle, right in front of that Human, They, In Awe, Then, In Utter Incredulity, and Then Disbelief of what they just witnesses, Cry Out "UN-believable" followed swiftly thereafter By the Cry, "Do It Again! Do It Again!!!-!" in the Voice of an much 'Overly Excited' ....CHild.

Why Is this, Ironic?

Cause .....thereafter...

There is that Human, Dead after Having lived out the fullness of their Life, Now Knowing It's Preciousness, Now Before God ....Now On their Knees, Now Begging God ...."Do it Again, PLEeeeease Do It Again"

Whats' the Irony? ....well, You, Cause your also the Miracle.

(Its' Probably a very old tale, but it arose in me, lately/recently ....soooo, (I) thought (I) might be able to remind everyone....Thanks!)

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

© Mr. Robin Parsons :cool: Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

If you Do 'Backwards' Logic, on Whats Above, well, the Life you are Leading, Right Now!, (and ...ALL Along!) YOU asked (Begged?) For IT ....So what was that, that you were WhiningAbout?

Oh Yes, as A Simply Point of "Truth" ...About me, IN/during My Life, (I) have had dental 'Needs' ...and, YUP!! (I) Whined about the Pain too, and during some of the 'Headaches' that (I) have, previously, Experenced, in my life..... and those Times (I) had broken Bones, Sliced open my leg, etc. etc. ....But (I) Have (BY Gods' Grace) Endevoured not to ....Whine/complain/(be-act)In-/Un-gratefully/In-/Un-graciously towards what God Has, so Generously/Kindly/Lovingly/truthfully 'permited me' .....to be.


:cool:

[jado818]

Feel free to flame me all you want Mr. Parson's.... but i thought this was a math website and not a religious website.... I fail too see the association between the two....

That is all...

[OfficeShredder]

jado, you're about to get ripped for thinking that god didn't invent math and physics :rolleyes:

[Epsilon=One]

jado, you're about to get ripped for thinking that god didn't invent math and physics :rolleyes:Right on! In the sense that math and physics are Natural . . . as is all that exists including consciousness.

However, the word "invent" is not very apropos as god has no anthropic qualities.

See: A Proof of God (http://www.CQthus.com/PT/PoG); and, Creed (http://www.CQthus.com/PT/Creed).

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Feel free to flame me all you want Mr. Parson's.... but i thought this was a math website and not a religious website.... I fail too see the association between the two....

That is all...

© Mr. Robin Parsons Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

Flame you? Why would (I) waste my time? as that would be following the example you and the two other posters herein have set, (Wasting time ....and server space....Sorta) so why would (I)bother?

Aside from that if you can read it this is the Physics PUB a Place for more general Discourses (Paradoxes says it/that right in the title)....you do know what that means ...Don't you?

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

jado, you're about to get ripped for thinking that god didn't invent math and physics :rolleyes:
© Mr. Robin Parsons :cool: Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

Only if that whatever (Lost in there own History) EP1 responds..... :eek: :rolleyes: :p ;) :D :cool:

[Epsilon=One]

Only if...EP1 responds...If you'll look at the above posts, you'll note that I did respond.

Your lack of response was amazing in that it indicated that you apparently agreed with my response.

Now I understand your lack of response: Omission rather than commission.

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

© Mr. Robin Parsons :cool: Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

(I) see that the only response (I) get, is from the one that (I) cannot see (He is on my Ignore list) responding.....Cool.

[Epsilon=One]

(I) see that the only response (I) get, is from the one that (I) cannot see (He is on my Ignore list) responding.....Cool."Ostriches" are not noted for their intelligence.

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Feel free to flame me all you want Mr. Parson's.... but i thought this was a math website and not a religious website.... I fail too see the association between the two.... That is all...

© Mr. Robin Parsons :cool: Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

So, jado818 this is a reference to what (I) recently wrote (http://physicsmathforums.com/showthread.php?p=4821#post4821) (It is posted/linked in these forums) as your attitude towards me shows some seemingly pre-inserted notions about me...

If you look at my join date, read any of what has transpired between myself and that seemingly 'kindly old Gentleman' Epsilon=One well, you would know better just why they pre-loaded (Opinionated) you concerning me....and, if you have/had a broad enough scope of ALL of the subject knowledge you might just end up arriving at the same, or a similar, conclusion to what (I) have....or not....as that would be your choice, not mine, just that well, take it from one who has spent the time (And has Some {50 Years} knowledge too) delving into what that Poster (Epsilon=One) says ....and does...He will lead you down an Errant pathway, teach you things that do not help in your schooling, if you want to follow what most of the rest of the People doing science follow/believe, nor will it per say help you to be intellectually improved as following one who persistently refuses to acknowledge the error of their own ways, thereafter obfuscating anything that even comes close to proving that well, (I) suppose it is a Good debating tactic if you do not really care about the veracity or reality of the side you are taking... (Or care about Knowledge)

After that well, keeping the elderly/aged company isn't really a Bad thing, it's actually nice of you to give him something to do...but Please be careful of accepting what he says as having validity, some of it only seems that way.....as any good Black Hatted Sophist could (and would) successfully be capable of doing.....

Thanks ...do whatever you want to, after all, your responsible for it.

[Epsilon=One]

...this is a reference to what (I) recently wrote (http://physicsmathforums.com/showthread.php?p=4821#post4821) (It is posted/linked in these forums)...

...and, if you have/had a broad enough scope of ALL of the subject knowledge you might just end up arriving at the same, or a similar, conclusion to what (I) have....or not....as that would be your choice, not mine, just that well, take it from one who has spent the time (And has Some {50 Years} knowledge too)...

...if you want to follow what most of the rest of the People doing science follow/believe, nor will it per say help you to be intellectually improved as following one who persistently refuses to acknowledge the error of their own ways, thereafter obfuscating anything that even comes close to proving that well, (I) suppose it is a Good debating tactic if you do not really care about the veracity or reality of the side you are taking... (Or care about Knowledge)

...but Please be careful of accepting what he [Epsilon=One] says as having validity, some of it only seems that way.....as any good Black Hatted Sophist could (and would) successfully be capable of doing.....

Thanks ...do whatever you want to, after all, your responsible for it.This is a fine example of what is wrong with today's "cookie cutter approach to status quo, "mob" education found in the pomo universities. Your comments appear to be drivel; as would be expected from many of today's post docs rather than support for probing, intelligent inquiry.

A recent E-mail that I sent concerning an annotated article in a university newspaper may be of interest. It follows with highlight color and notes added.Subject: FYI Re: College Degrees Have Become Meaningless
From: sysop@hipriority.info
Date: Sat, Oct 14, 2006 6:36 pm
To: [Deleted]
Cc: Jesse Nickles <JNickles@uci.edu>

College Degrees Have Become Meaningless

By Jesse Nickles

College, as we know it in modern times, has become worthless. The idea of a university is rooted in the Latin “universitas,” pioneered particularly by Plato, meant to describe a corporation of students interacting within an atmosphere that fosters genius, creates culture and balances scientific research with artistic inquiry, among other things. The American university, however, as the modern template of higher education, has sucked out the passion and honesty needed to inspire such an environment.

Plato once advised, “Do not train children to learn by force and harshness, but direct them to it by what amuses their minds, so that you may be better able to discover with accuracy the peculiar bent of the genius of each.” Such advice has been echoed throughout history by thinkers like Maria Montessori, who strongly believed that teaching children involved encouraging them to ask questions, solve problems and correct themselves in an applied manner. She emphasized the balanced individual who is conscious of family, health and interaction while gaining a sense of competence and progress.

(Brunardot Note: I wonder if Jesse has heard of the Waldorf schools???

Very little is learned until a person learns how to ask questions.)

The atmosphere in which we now attempt to develop ourselves as intellectuals consists of a politically correct, subdivided, unengaged, multiple-choice, black-and-white, never-below-the-surface education system that is overly sensitive to multiculturalism and free of strong opinions.

Part of this change most definitely lies in the fact that universities almost always used to be privately owned and controlled, were inspired by national identity and regional dialogues and were generally made up of a small, privileged group of people.

This, of course, brings us to the fact that nearly everyone these days is pursuing higher education when the opportunity arises. And like everything else that becomes trendy and mass-produced, the unique qualities that once existed in the university setting have now merged with generally accepted international notions and approaches. That is, the university has become a consumer-oriented market that seems like little more than a stomping ground for the media and corporate world, free of originality, as it subconsciously becomes the biggest spoon in the great soup of globalization.

Albert Einstein, perhaps one of the last mythical figures in the modern intellectual world, seemed to describe our current situation most eloquently when he said, “Most teachers waste their time by asking questions which are intended to discover what a pupil does not know, whereas the true art of questioning has for its purpose to discover what the pupil knows or is capable of knowing.”

I couldn’t agree more. I can’t tell you how sick I am of walking into my new classes each quarter and hearing students only raise questions about grading scales, due dates and other obsessive intricacies. The saddest part, however, is that our university professors, not to mention the university system in general, are the ones instigating such an empty atmosphere. Perhaps with enough money students might find a private university somewhere that still encourages discussions, raw honesty, the pursuit of creative knowledge and fascination with life.

(Brunardot Note: A primary goal of Conceptualism is to develop such institutions . . . possibly on the internet . . . with most student costs subsidized. The process would be to teach an interest in how to acquire knowledge, rather than the knowledge itself.)

Bachelor’s degrees have become nothing more than a social status, a ticket to ride. Like a wise man from the UC Irvine Humanities department once told me, some degrees are like a California driver’s license: you can’t get by without one, but if you have one, no one gives a shit.

And that, my friends, is the Catch-22, because no one will believe you if you say a college degree is worthless unless you already have one under your belt.

I’m sure it has something to do with a culture that says art no longer needs to involve beauty, science is incompatible with religion, songs can’t be more than three and a half minutes long and chatting is something you do on the Internet behind a firewall.

(Brunardot Note: There is a difference between “organized” religion and Theology/personal religion.)
That same culture might be shocked to hear Galileo come forth and say, “I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with senses, reason and intellect has intended us to forego their use.”

Jesse Nickles is a fourth-year international studies and Spanish double major. He can be reached at jnickles@uci.edu.

©2006 New University Newspaper
Reproduction

(Brunardot Note: With any luck, I’ll chase down Jesse next week and see if there are common interests; also, I’ll copy this E-mail to him (I’ll probably hear something about copyright infringement?!?!)

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

© Mr. Robin Parsons :cool: Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

Only A WORLD {SPAM}SSALC{X} TWIT would respond when they know that the other person will never see it...

TWIT! you are PROOF!

[Epsilon=One]

Only A WORLD {SPAM}SSALC{X} TWIT would respond when they know that the other person will never see it...

TWIT! you are PROOF!If I responded for you alone, there would be nary a response. There's a world of Viewers that note your comments; hopefully, a few will note the responses that they garner.

For one that professes to "never see it"; there seems to come a plethora of irksome responses.

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

© Mr. Robin Parsons :cool: Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

Repeat post #13

Figure it out, (I) cannot see your responses and (I) do NOT look for them!

[Epsilon=One]

Repeat post #13Your post #13 is entirely irrelevant to the topic of this thread; it would be deleted on any other forum.

The freedoms that you enjoy at PMF should be used positively; rather than with your continual waste of server real estate and the tolerance of the outside Viewers' patience, decorum, and time.

[jado818]

[QUOTE=Mr. Robin Parsons]© Mr. Robin Parsons Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

Flame you? Why would (I) waste my time? as that would be following the example you and the two other posters herein have set/
QUOTE]


I didn't argue with you in any way... I simple pointed out my lack of understanding of the connection between the two.... I was hoping you would be able to explain further on the way mathematics and religion are connected in tangible ways.

Jack

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

I didn't argue with you in any way... I simple pointed out my lack of understanding of the connection between the two.... I was hoping you would be able to explain further on the way mathematics and religion are connected in tangible ways.

Jack
© Mr. Robin Parsons Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

O.K. Thanks but that was not quite what this thread was started for, as the title of these forums tells....

Physics, Astronomy, Math, and Philosophy Forums.

Philosphy is included and that was/is the point of this thread...

As for tangible connections between math and religion, given that math is a language discribing quantities and religion is a "System of Following beliefs" (I) kinda find the two as not connected in anything other then a rather cursory manner....certainly not a tangible one other then there are sixty Books that comprise the Judeo Christian Bible, so many years of Historical evidence that kind of stuff, pertinet only to quantities.....

But thanks for asking. :D

[Epsilon=One]

As for tangible connections between math and religion, given that math is a language discribing quantities and religion is a "System of Following beliefs" (I) kinda find the two as not connected in anything other then a rather cursory manner....certainly not a tangible one...I would think that world-cla ss [prior word formatted to delete SPAM filter] philosophers would agree that religions and mathematics are tangibly connected in that neither have been academically proven.

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

© Mr. Robin Parsons :cool: Kingston Ontario Canada MMVI

guess you missed this part Challenge to Epsilon=One GO! & STAY! AWAY! (from me) right? it is in my signature in case you didn't notice it ......yet.....no surprise there......either.